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| Consumer Review: After Taking Androstenedione For About 3 Months, My Son Who Is Into Bodybuilding Literally Attacked Me Physically. |
After taking androstenedione for about 3 months, my son who is into bodybuilding literally attacked me physically. He picked me up and threw me down on an outside deck causing much bruising. As he was still vocalizing threatening behavior & holding a lawn chair up as though to strike me, I managed to call 911 on my cordless phone outside. He was arrested and has now been charged by the city attorney with domestic abuse. My son has NO history of violence whatsoever. We were having a disagreement over his involvement with his new girlfriend, but nothing to incite such a reaction. We had always talked through any disagreements. I should add that he is a college student - premed major with a 3.9 gpa. Our relationship has been very close & loving until this unusual episode.
This whole event prompted looking at supplements he was taking including creatine, dhea, weight gainer, and Andro-6. We believe there is a connection between his aggressive behavior & Andro-6 (he was cycling on this).
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| Response #1 |
Androstenedione does not cause "Roid Rage". Over aggressive behavior caused by illegal steroid abuse usually occurs in persons with an underlying psycho-social disorder. Basically, steroids make axx holes bigger axx holes. You need to blame your son for his actions not androstenedione. Ref: New England Journal Of Medicine; Suprapharmacologic doses of testosterone in normal men. Conclusions on aggressive behavior was it didn`t happen.
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| Response #1 To Response #1 |
If you don't think androstenedione causes hyper aggressive behavior, then you must be on it and consequently aggressively defensive. My brother is on the stuff and he's not the same person he was before he started taking the stuff. He's meaner and short-tempered and everyone around him is afraid of his mood swings. We can't even discuss trivial matters without him losing his temper. In 20 years, the guy never had mood swing problems. He was also a good student and a generally recognized nice guy. Now he uses the androstenedione, and he's more aggressive, constantly defensive, and really mean. This looks like a correlation to me.
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| Response #2 |
| My brother is using androstenedione and the primary effect that our family and friends have noticed is that he's become a lot more aggressive, defensive, and mean. While he's always had "attitude," he's now gotten so aggressive that we can't speak to him without triggering his ever-shortening temper. We're afraid to go near him now, since he was already strong enough to seriously hurt us if he got violent and now he's always angry and ready to fight.
I've been searching the medical and science databases for enough information on the downsides of this stuff to convince him to quit taking it, but there aren't any definitive studies yet. If you're thinking about taking it, please don't. All you'll succeed in doing is alienating everyone you care about with the increased aggression and shorter temper the hormones give you. I'm not signing my name to this because my brother will beat the tar out of me if he sees this on the internet with my name on it, but I think everyone needs to know about the emotional side effects of androstenedione.
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| Response #3 |
I'm a natural bodybuilder and a a man of true fighting spirit. All these guys who take this sh–– and lose their temper and scare everybody, bring them down here to Theodore, Alabama and let them lose their temper with me. I'll beat their goddamn axxes.
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| Response #4 |
| I'm writing to you because I believe there is a severe problem with the use of the supplement Androstene and its negative effects on teenagers and young adults.
I am 17 years old and go through daily weight training, sprinting, and various football workouts. As a starting high school quarterback in a 5A Texas school, being strong and having power is not an option, it's expected. I have taken Androstene for a month now at 200mg a day. The effects have been astounding. I have increased my bench by 15%, squat by20%, and power clean by 30%.
I know that people, in response to the supplement, have complained about moodiness and strange attitudes, but I can assure you that the problems do not stop there. Lately, I have suffered from extremely violent mood swings and back problems due to torn muscles. I come from a very wealthy background in Houston, Texas where football is seen as a way of life, where winning is driven into your mind everyday. I have been so out of whack with reality due to "Andro" that earlier this week my mom and I had an argument and I had to stop myself from hitting her in the face. My girlfriend has noticed my continuous sullen mood and aggression also. I repeatedly burst into tears of frustration when things do not go perfectly, and am constantly on the edge if someone makes me angry.
Use of this supplement is not a joking matter. It needs to be well supervised and controlled. I wish to warn all of those young athletes out there who want to get strong quickly that research of this supplement is required and that winning is not important if it means killing your body and the people around you. Thank you for your time.
Sincerely,
C. A.
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| Response #5 |
I have been lifting weights at high intensity now for about a month and a half. I recently started taking androstenedione also. While on the andro my aggression goes through the roof. I am so impatient that I get irritated that I have to wait in between sets. The good side of this is that I feel like lifting extremely hard. I take 100 mg 30 minutes prior to working out. About one hour after I'm done training the aggression rapidly declines. I would not have any idea why this stuff is making people have outstanding aggression unless they are continually using it throughout the day.
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| Response #6 |
It has been proven in the few studies done on andro that it is meant to be taken before workouts and its testosterone boosting effects die off after an hour.
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| Response #7 |
| I have been a serious bodybuilder for 14 years and have used many different supplements. I have been using andro on and off for a little more than a year. I do 100 mg a day for three weeks and then skip a week or sometimes two. I am a security person or (BOUNCER) in a big club and encounter many different situations in a night. I have noticed my fuse is a lot shorter after being on the andro for more than a few weeks. My wife has also mentioned to me that she has noticed a change in my temperament when I am on the andro.
I tried steroids when I was young and stupid and compare the change in mood to a junior case of roid rage. The "experts" say that roid rage does not exist. So, like the letter at the top of the page, the medical experts will say this does not exist either. They say if you have emotional problems or temper problems this can worsen them, but that is still saying it can change your temperament.
I am going to the police academy and seriously thinking of stopping the use of andro when I finish because of the effect on my temperament. I have also noticed changes in my friends on andro. Some of them take high doses. Some say it does not do more if you take more than recommended, but I believe it effects your personality. Study supplements, it is especially easy on internet, be careful, and use your head.
Longtime bodybuilder,
T2
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Response #8
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I have been taking Andro off and on for about 2 months. I have not noticed a slight change in my temperament. Recently, I was having pains in the groin area and after seeing a doctor was told that my prostate gland was very enlarged and infected. My doctor recommended that I discontinue using the Andro and he gave me some medicine to heal the prostate gland. I have been doing research on the net recently as well. I have discovered two pieces of information that have not been widely publicized. One of which is that there are reports of side effects which include gland enlargement, kidney and liver damage. I have also read that Andro is technically really an anabolic steroid. Due to the fact that the source of the product is naturally occurring, combined with the laws regarding supplements they are able to categorize this product as a nutritional supplement.
I have also read in several places especially on all bottles of Andro that it should NOT be taken by anyone under 18 and many nutritional experts have suggested that anyone under 25 not take this product. The testosterone levels of males in their teens is already above normal by more than at any other age. Andro can increase the levels of testosterone to dangerous levels. This may account for excessively aggressive behavior in some young males. I think more should be studied on this product, including more on long term side effects as has been done with some of the other supplements before it is so widely accepted as ok. I don't believe the companies that manufacture these products are in any hurry right now to fund this kind of effort nor are they the ones supplying this kind of information for their customers. Note that all of the side effects discovered so far are the same as with anabolic steroids just not as noticeably severe. I will no longer use any kind of Andro product.
Sincerely,
PS
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Response #9
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I read these and it seems odd that so many of the responses said that Andro causes temper flares, but the writers are not stopping immediately. This seems to exemplify addictive behavior. Is it possible that Andro is addictive?
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Response #10
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Hey #9, that is pretty far out there! I used Andro every day for about 2 months and my wife will testify that I did not change at all. I don't understand where the rest of this comes from. Maybe men with the hamfisted superhuman macho attitude are just finding a subconscious reason to get mad.
I mean, many men already have this "I am mean as Hell" attitude and the strength increases and size changes are maybe just tipping their egos over the edge!
I have been off Andro for about a month now because my schedule does not allow me to workout at this time and I want to save all of my stuff! I have had no withdrawals or shakes and DT's. :-)
If there is any addiction, it is an addiction to that "pumped" feeling and the weight increases. Yeah, I'm addicted to being able to lift and do a lot more reps when I'm on it! I'm addicted to gaining 10 lbs in a month! I'm addicted to increasing the weight almost weekly!
Just my nickels worth.
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Response #11
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| I've been studying Andro and its effects and different people's opinions about them. The effects are very inconsistent varying from a rise in temper to sensitive nipples. I would suggest that there would be two factors causing this extreme variation. One would be a person's body chemistry. Andro is no different than anything else that alters your chemical makeup. Just like beer, well affect different people differently. The second factor would seem to have a great deal to do with someone's mental capacities. If someone already has a short temper then of course they will fly off the handle when on Andro but one the other hand, if someone is very calm and has a little self control the effects might not be as drastic.
The real point that I'm trying to make is that Andro does not have a definite side effect and that if you're interested in taking it then do it but do it safely. Only you know when your body is hurting or getting stronger. I would also suggest researching Andro and all these other supplements because you need to be informed of what side effects to expect so you can see them early and take the necessary precautions. In short, trust yourself and your body. Don't push it when it says stop and you should be OK. Just be smart.
CS
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Response #12
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Funny, I have been working out for 4 years and know plenty of people into bodybuilding. Every one of them are the nicest people you could ever meet and they all use some form of Andro and have been for sometime. Being the son of a psychologist, I agree with medical studies that show the rage to be a form of physiological disorder.
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Response #13
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I am twenty years old and have been on and off andro for a few months now. I have definitely noticed that at times I do feel a little bit more aggressive, but I have never had the urge to beat the hell out of someone any more than I did before I was off the drug. To the people who are having problems I would like to ask if you are possibly abusing this supplement by taking too much? I have found a decent increase in strength, but my stamina and intensity is through the roof. I am taking this supplement an hour before my workout and after the workout I do not feel as tired as I usually would. I have no problems studying and I am holding a 3.4 G.P.A. The one effect that I will admit that I have is addiction. If I don't take this pill for two days I experience severe headaches and nausea. On my off week after a cycle the week starts off tough because of the way that I feel. I would not be progressing in strength nearly as fast without this supplement
D.P.D.
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Response #14
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I am an 18 year old college student who has been on andro fuel by Twin Lab for the past few months. I cycle it every few weeks and I definitely think it is a supplement worth purchasing. I see no difference between my aggressiveness while taking it. I never have the urge to beat the s--- out of somebody and it hasn't changed, although I am still an aggressive person. It definitely gives me more stamina while I am working out and I never get tired or sore while I am doing certain exercises. ON my off cycles, I do get tired and exhausted. If you want to improve your lifting, get andro, period.
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Response #15
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| Well, personally I don't think Andro causes over-aggression. It isn't a steroid like halotestin, cheque drops or methyl test. It would be ranked maybe a 1 on a scale of 1 to 10 when compared to these drugs. It simply doesn't elevate your testosterone levels for a long enough period to keep you mean. It may make you temporarily slightly more aggressive, but that's it.
I have taken all those andro products and I don't think any of them are worth the money personally. All of those androstenedione and androstendiol and norandro are much weaker than even the most mild steroids, and some more costly. Your money would be better spent on a weak steroid like anavar, or injectable winstrol. Hell, even Deca or equipoise.
I am not sure how you guys are getting such great results with andro, I think a lot of it is mental, but that's just my opinion, As for the main topic, if your son is into competitive body building he might be on steroids and that could cause his aggression. However, having used steroids before, I know that most don't cause over-aggression like that. The only one I have been on is halotestin, so either you guys who claim to have these humongous aggression increases are lying or are taking too high doses of this andro s--- or just don't know how to control your temper. I guarantee my current steroid cycle of Testosterone Cypionate, Norandren 200, and Dianabol has my test levels raised higher than any of yours but I don't have any UNCONTROLLABLE rages. I might be slightly more aggressive but that's about it.
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Response #16
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| I'm a 17 year old wrestler in Richmond, VA and I've been using andro (mainly before matches and practices) and it only affects me for a period of (something like) 3-5 hours, depending on dosage and what I have eaten prior to it. I took Bio H last year and I have come to two little conclusions about this product.
1) it affects everyone different, because my effects are not as severe as attacking good ol' mom and pop.
2) Is everyone using this stuff on other performance enhancing "drugs" like creatine or some other form of pseudo-steroid? I took it once for one week without whey protein or creatine and I experienced just about no mood changes at all.
Maybe it's a chemical imbalance or something between drugs? Well just my opinion, but what do I know, I'm just a junior.
HotDog
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Response #17
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| I have been lifting weights seriously for about two years now and recently experimented with 19 Nor Androstenadiol. The only change that I noticed was in my performance. I took this supplement twice daily along with creatine and I gained strength and size in all areas. I finished 60 tablets. This was about a month ago. Since then, I have not taken any supplements. I was the same person then as I was now. I do not have any violent tenancies now, nor did I while I was on Andro.
I truly believe that it is all in the mind of the beholder. If one believes that Andro is going to change their mood, then eventually it will. It is called the self fulfilling prophecy. Believe something long enough and eventually it will come true. Besides, in most of the cases I have researched, the user continuously uses the supplement for months upon months when they know that the recommended cycle is on for two to three weeks and then off for two to three weeks. Use your brains and be smart. These supplements are not made for everyone.
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Response #18
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Response #3 is damn right. You bunch of women should not be taking any of these supplements to make yourself bigger. Either you have it or you do not. It is all in the genetics you thin, skinny-framed bunch of women look-a-likes trying to get big. If you do want to get big, eat protein and pump out. That is simple. Leave the supplements aside. Look at yourself carefully in the mirror. What do you see? Not Tank Abbot, but a skinny, small, thin-boned woman. The good old days when everybody (like me) was big have gone. 100 years ago women were bigger than all these bodybuilders around. But on the other hand, if response 3 wants to fight, lets do it. Come down to BRIXTON, LONDON. It's dirty and mean on the street. And always remember, size does not matter (but it helps)!
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Response #19
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| There are no fighters in Alabama, nor are there in London. Rednecks in Bama and soccer hooligans in England all "tough" due to the imbibing of Jack Daniel's and beer respectively. And Andro, I am sure. I took Andro. I swear by my mother it made me more aggressive. No question. As I told my therapist about my aggressive behaiour and concern regarding it, she was concerned, and asked me if I took steroids. I emphatically said no, but in hindsight it's a blurry yes.
That steroid junkie guy wants to be the king of all steroid users and thus demotes andro as not in the league as he has taken big risks. Now Andro comes along, and a lot of guys are gettin' bigger without the more serious side effects of Andro. So his place in the world is threatened. Now everyone is on "steroids" - or Lite steroids. It's a foolish game. I'm done with that crap, not worth it. Such an irony. We eat clean, exercise, etc. and at the same time take stuff that is dangerous and harmful. All of the fat cats at Twinlab, Pinnacle etc. are laughing at our expense. We are pathetic!!!
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Response #20
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A-men #19. We are PATHETIC!! However, I doubt anyone can be more pathetic then to toss your own lovin' mamma around! I believe the question is, "Just how LOW will you go?" Now, for all of you hillbilly boys talk'n trash, get a life. I am a serious full contact fighter with some very impressive titles. However, last year I seriously overtrained while training for the Olympic card. To make a long story short, I wanted to move to heavy weight without the use of steroids. Several of my friends tried them to "get big quick" without the work. They did... but now they are flabby. So, I did my research and ended up with Andro.
I found a nice little package from Prohormone. One pill when you wake up, 2-pre, and 2-post. They contained nothing but goodness! Everything from Androstenedione, andro-4, Andro-5, Nor, 19-nor, chromium, DHEA, and an estrogen blocker. Combined with some mass gainer and aminos, I gained a solid 10 lbs. in less then a month.
It worked great for the first week, then my body got used to it. So, on work-out days I doubled it. That worked for about another week, but then my body got used to it again, so then I tripled it. Wow, then came the size! After a week, I stopped to let my body recover. The side effects I noticed were major irritability, mood swings from depression to ecstasy, the OCCASIONAL zit, headaches, paranoia, and near the end with the extreme dosages my boys shrank a little. However, I became more confident and much more physched when it came to working out. All I could think about was working out.
As for raging? I was very concerned because I love to fight anywhere with anybody over anything, and the police know me. The andro made me irritable and annoying UNTIL I worked out. All my energy and anger was eaten up by the weights. That's what it's for! Not yo mamma, but the flippin iron plates!
This is my story. A guy who probably took way too much, spent too much money, got similar side effects, and was probably better off doing a light dose of deca.
Take it for what its worth. |
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Response #21
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From what I've observed, all the folks complaining about increased aggression are either stacking, on high doses, or teenagers.
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Response #22
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| I'm 18 and was seriously thinking of using andro. You guys have definitely persuaded me otherwise. I would prefer to do it the natural way anyhow.
G.R.
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Response #23
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Everybody has their own account about what Androstene does. Talking about side effects, I can't help but wonder what does whatever #3 wrote have to do with this topic. He must be a very insecure "bodybuilder." If all these people who wrote a response here would go to Theodore, Alabama, I bet he'd be running for cover. I'm taking andro, but I haven't seen dramatic changes in my behavior. However, I took DHEA for a while and I was feeling angry all the time, ready to fight, and my libido was through the roof. I do believe that increased testosterone levels cause a person to become more irritable.
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Response #24
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| At this time, I am taking Nor androstenedione 100mg, 19 Norandrostenedione 100mg, 5-Androstenediol 100mg, Creatine monohydrate, vanadyl sulfate and Tribbuleus T. I have found this combination to be absolutely amazing. I have never had better gains in my life, except when I did Russian dinabol.
The way I feel is that roid rage is very true. I am a very calm laid back non temperamental person. The effect the Russian dinabol had on me was scary. I could not control my self at all. I never caused harm to anyone, even though I may have wanted to. I took it all to the gym. I do believe that the people that do take it out on other people physically are lacking the self control to hold back. But, I do believe that if the person was not on the steroid that they would not have been physical with anyone.
I do not do steroids anymore. That is in the past. I have many regrets for doing it and wish I never had. It messed me up for a good 6 months even after I had stopped taking it. I was always tired, run down and had no desire to work out again. Four years later, I am working out again and taking the above stated supplements. I must say I have noticed some irritability and mood swings. I must state that the andro and the Russian dinabol are not even in the same league as for aggression. On a scale of 1 to 10, the Russian d-ball is a 8-10 and the andro is a 3-4.
My wife knew I was taking supplements, but didn't know what I was taking. She even asked me if I was taking anything different from usual because I seemed to be short tempered and easily irritable. I do feel that andro does cause aggression in certain individuals. Everyone forgets that everyone's body will react differently to different substances. I will continue to take andro unless my aggression gets out of control, which I don't believe will happen.
Even though I stated that I don't believe that andro could cause such an aggressive attack, people do react differently, so yes it is possible. If this is the person's case, I strongly discourage the use of such a product for their own safety and others.
Your Friend from Canada,
Brendan
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Response #25
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My personal opinion is that all of the hormone precursors are a complete waste of time. I researched the topic for a college paper (and also for my own personal knowledge) and found that despite how they are marketed, most of the stuff gets burned by the stomach. Of even more concern is the conversion to estrogen. Most of the stuff that makes it through gets converted into the female sex hormone, which doesn't sound good to me unless you want tits.
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Response #26
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I'm sorry guys, but some of you have to realize that there is NO SUCH THING AS ROID RAGE! It's the media's way of saying, "Ratings."
Anyhow, I understand the concern people have over increased aggression. Some people do become more aggressive, but they have to have aggressiveness in them. As for the mom who got attacked, my God...that's scary. I'm just glad that you were able to call 911 and we not harmed more than you were.
My friends and I have used steroids and we have NEVER had a rage on anyone. We're calm individuals who study hard, get great grades, and have a passion for body building. Hell, we have social lives, we love to go out, people like to hang around with us, and we have NEVER been in any fights at all. We just back down...we have nothing to prove to anyone but ourselves and we know who we are as individuals. Yes, once in a while someone hits us because they're frustrated that we won't fight them, but all we do is hold them down and ask if they're done. But this has only happened twice in 2 years.
As the mom above stated, her son went to med school and has a GPA that I'm jealous of! So he knew what he was getting into. Yes, there are some idiots out there and they are the people who give steroid use a bad name. However, the majority of steroid users are calm, kind, and willing to help others out.
Also, just to show you something interesting, my friends and I did an experiment. One kid we didn't know that well wanted to use dbol (an oral steroid). Well, he was too young and my friends and I discussed it and we gave him tablets that were nothing more than sugar. He took them and in about 30 minutes he thought he was some tough guy. He went to the weights and started lifting with us, and within 2 weeks he had added 20lbs to his bench press, 50 lbs to his squats, and he was stronger in everything. AND he was more aggressive. But all he was taking was a little bit of sugar (we were giving him 4 tabs a day). Well, he looked a little bit better in 6 weeks, he was stronger, but man was he ever the aggressor. So, it was all in his head...reason it was in his head was because all he ever heard was that "steroids make you aggressive."
So, to the worried mom, it wasn't the andro that made your son aggressive, it was the idea in his head that he should be aggressive. Also, I don't mean to insult your son because he is obviously an extremely intelligent man...however, anger management is something he should work on. If he flipped out because he was "on andro," then he has some unresolved issues that he has to deal with. But I don't know him or you so I could be completely wrong too. I don't mean to insult him or you, just telling you what I think.
But the coolest thing is that you actually posted asking for people's opinions on this matter, which shows you really love him and care for him. I remember the look on my mom's face when she realized I was on steroids. She was devastated, but after showing her that I did my research, knew what I was getting into, and had back-up plans if anything went wrong, she was more relaxed. Still not accepting it, but more relaxed. My mom would never have posted on a BBoard (even an anonymous one like this) because she's a bit embarrassed. In any case though, if your son is still interested in body building there are many alternatives that are available to him that do not involve andro or steroids.
With much respect to you all,
Speedy
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Response #27
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I am not presently using any form of Andro, but was considering it. After reading through the first 15 responses, it became evident that whether or not you have a problem with controlling your anger/aggression, the problem may derive from the testosterone levels already present in the body. For instance, if the level was high (like in an 18 to 25 year old) it seems likely to induce aggression (although it wouldn't effect every man because every man wouldn't have the same levels). Also, if the levels were low (men 30 and up) it might not have any effect because at around 30 the level starts dropping off (normally due to our diets) so the anger and aggression may never be an issue.
I will still continue to research info about Andro and it's counterparts, but I appreciate all the feedback on this because we all know how the distributor's would much rather rush the product out to public before thoroughly checking it out or listing all of the possible side affects.
Dave in P-cola
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Response #28
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| Andro is one of those supplements that really works. I mean for $10 bucks you can't get any supplements that work except for andro. I took andro for a few months, cycling off every 3 weeks, and the pump I got in the gym was unreal. However, it wasn't worth it because once you're off it, you lose everything. The strength, the pump, any muscle size and weight you've gained. It's a waste of time unless you stay on andro.
For the record, andro does make you lose your temper. I have patience like a mutha...but when I was on andro I was the biggest dick to everybody. It makes you lose your temper without any reason. The bottom line is it fu––s you up, and anybody who says it doesn't is full of sh––!
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Response #29
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Some of you are terribly misinformed. Before you go out on the internet and post a bunch of garbage (like the person who started this whole thread), please do your homework. Anyone claiming to have experienced "roid rage" off of andro is totally full of it. The stuff does nothing. Chances are that they are actually using real anabolic steroids (Halo, D-bol, sus, whatever) and were just telling everyone they are on "andro." Sheeeesh, this is the dumbest thing I have ever read. Hey, I have some oceanfront property for sale in North Dakota, please e-mail me for details!
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Response #30
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| In response to all the letters above, it sounds like the United Nations on Andro. Not meaning to sound like I'm trying to please everybody, but you all are right. I guess the big point is that everybody reacts differently to the stuff. Screw all the quacks who say that people with mental "disorders" or emotional trauma are the ones most likely have a rage. It's all in the attitude and how each individual approaches their use of Andro.
I have several friends that take Andro, as recommended of course, and some of these "stacks" were custom made by reputable establishments in town. Let me tell you, they worked for the duration my friends were on these stacks. These guys made all kinds of gains in strength and size. One of my friends made such gains that you could actually see the muscle striations through his 7mm wet-suit when we went diving. These guys did show some aggression and mood swings, but if you knew the nature of our job and the morons we work for, it would be understandable.
Myself, I have tried Andro, and it did give me an awesome rush and major energy boost. I didn't really notice any major increases in strength or lean muscle mass while I was on cycle. I did notice my temper was a lot easier to set off, and I had a major lost of tolerance for a lot of things. The only thing that kept me from trashing a lot of stuff was the conscious reminder that my emotional imbalance might have been due to something else, like maybe the Andro, so I had to keep myself in check and walk away until I calmed down. It worked, but it was an effort. Hell, me and my friends would get goose pimples just talking about working out, whether it be running, swimming, going to the gym, diving, whatever.
I guess the long winded point I'm trying to make is that everyone needs to be personally responsible when considering taking something "extra" to give them that edge. Remember, guys like Arnold, Franco, Kevin Levrone, Rich Gaspari, to name a few, either didn't have any of the supplements that we have today, or didn't have as many. Look at these guys. Hard work, determination, and good old fashion sweat are what they had, and a good nutritional diet. All I've been taking for a long time are Creatine, multivitamins, and an energy booster. I've made more gains from these few things compared to some of the guys that I work out with who are taking so many supplements that their lockers look like damn pharmacies PEOPLE!!!! Be real, honest, good to yourself and others, and most importantly, STAY HUNGRY!!! Happiness is a huge ass pool of sweat at your last workout station.
Dave G. aka: NAUIKID
San Diego, CA
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Response #31
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| Alright guys, I don't know a whole lot about the supplements in question. But I do have a brother that went through this sort of thing. Once, long ago he started working out and his whole attitude changed, period! He became strong and people looked up to him AND HE LOVED IT! "Mr. Bad Man!" became quite an a––hole himself. He believed, to a certain extent, that he was beyond reproach. People let him get away with sh–– and he continued to do it.
Question and Answer for you: Do you think he might have always been an a––hole and the added "man-muscle" (working out) had something to do with him acting the way he did? You know, the "I have muscles now and I don't have to take any sh–– no more" and "I'll show you" and "shut up or I'll..." mentality? I do. I believe deep down, if you "think" you're a pussy, you'll do whatever you can to convince yourself that you're not one.
I think this is a self-confidence and self-awareness issue, not a question of what pills did he take to made him change. I take several of the supplements mentioned throughout this thread, and while I notice increases in strength, size and stamina, the urge to kick the living sh-- out of some a––hole that desperately needs or deserves it doesn't come into the scheme of things. Everybody should take responsibility for your own actions. If you "sh––" the bed, get up and change the sheets, don't roll around in it. Unless you like rolling around in "sh––tty sheets," and that, my friend, is a different subject entirely. And as Paul Harvey says,.............good-day.
Obie
Somewhere in Florida
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Response #32
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I sincerely doubt that andro or any other supplement can provoke a loss of one's rational thinking unless there is an underlying psychological problem. Most of the aggressive behavior is due to the simple fact that everyone says that andro should make you more aggressive, therefore when people ingest it they are already thinking along those lines and act accordingly.
Personally, I am taking more steroids on a weekly basis then you would find in a CASE of andro and I have no aggressive problems at all. Possibly it's because I am aware of real steroids' tendencies to increase aggression so I overcompensate but making myself even more low key. In reality, the only person or thing I get even slightly aggravated with is myself when I overlook a small/easy problem at work in search of a larger one and waste my time.
my .02
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Response #33
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| To the ones that say their is no such thing as roid rage, especially #26, you indeed have your facts wrong. Androstenedione does not have nearly the effects from a testosterone standpoint as real steroids, but it does raise levels of serum testosterone in males for approximately 1.5 hours, 15 minutes after of consumption. Now, this does not affect all people the same of course, but it can affect some more than others. It is somewhat connected to a person's psychological disposition.
Any increase in either growth hormone or testosterone in the human male body can lead to increased aggression. This is a common medical fact. I will agree with some of your views, that many of these subjects are probably using other supplements with andro, which synergies the aggression factor (DHEA, GHB, etc.). I also will say that some, like the boy who was arrested, should be checked by his mother through the court for traces of possible steroid use in the bloodstream. Taking growth enhancing products that cause aggression to increase can sometimes be traced back to low self esteem and suppressed feelings of anger which the supplements (especially those that increase testosterone and growth hormone) bring out.
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Response #34
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| I have read all the responses thoroughly and have come up with this: I myself am on andro, 19-nor, and DHEA. I am cycling them for 4 weeks on and 2 weeks off. I have never felt more or less aggressive. The only aggression and attitude I have is the same amount that I had before I started taking it.
My take on andro is this: it works. I am a competitive bodybuilder and have competed a few times and know a lot of amateurs and some pros. I won't mention names, but of all the pros I know, they ensure me that they (along with most pros) are on steroids. A lot of them tell me it's very hard to turn pro (which is my goal) without using them. They usually only share this knowledge with people they know who won't rat them out and are serious themselves about turning pro. In all the competitions I have done, just about every competitor was using steroids. This is the fact: You can't compete with people on steroids.
I think andro is wonderful because it is not a steroid and it is legal. I have not experienced any side effects at all and my dosages are higher than recommended. To all the people who become more aggressive, I say this: the aggression is not the problem. The problem lies is that you can't control your own actions. Don't blame it on a drug or supplement. Blame it on a lack of will power to control yourself. There was only one supplement that made me a little more moody, and that was creatine. My wife tells me that she noticed a change in my attitude. I didn't notice the change, but then again, I don't notice my attitude change when I diet down for a competition either. If anybody gets moody from that, believe me, it would be me. However, unlike the people mentioned above who want to go kill and hurt everyone dear to them and every stranger they meet, you got more issues than being on a supplement. I never once raised my hand to my wife or my parents while I have been on any supplement, not even when I dieted. Why? Because I don't lack the self-control that everyone else listed above lacks. I don't even think I thought about hurting anyone.
I will tell you this: The worst attitude I get is when I diet down for a competition. All that happens to me is that I get frustrated very easily. The reason that happens is due to a chemical imbalance in me. Most the time, it's my fat content is too low. I think that was the case with the creatine. I've taken different brands of creatine, and my wife has only noticed my change of attitude when I take the creatine with the loader already in it. If it doesn't have the loader in it, she has never noticed a change in me. I think it has to do with that the loader or the brand I buy that has the loader in it causing a chemical imbalance in me.
One last note. All the people above who mention all those anger and aggression problems don't mention how they are taking the andro. You are supposed to cycle it. If you don't, you end up abusing it. That holds true with steroids too. It's not that they are bad, it's that people over abuse them and give them a bad name. People should educate themselves on it first. And for people who think that all pros are clean, do you think that Nasser, Flex, Coleman, or Levrone got as big a they are by just eating and training? Please. One of the pros I know, knows all the above mentioned pros I listed, and they will beg to differ. All 4 of those gentleman personally told them what they were on. Anyway, if you want to get technical, anything in excess is bad and becomes abusive, and that holds true for everything.
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Response #35
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To the "worried mom" - you are not a worried mom at all, you are obviously a campaigner. If I have to point out the holes in your story to everyone, then they are all half-brains. So a "worried mom" who knows little about supps or training knows all about "cycling"??? and exactly what the products are, and hyper aggression??? My fricking arse she does. And what an educated response "oh you're only defending it cos you must be on it and consequently aggressively defensive". Please.
Andros are more dangerous than AS, no doubts. BUT neither will promote any unnatural aggression that was not already underlying. Did you consider that maybe he became arrogant, aggro and an asshole because he suddenly though he was king-sh–– for lifting weights?
Oh yes, how come all those recovering cancer and other critically ill patients who are on courses of AS aren't running around killing everyone? Hmmmmmmm.
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Response #36
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| I have been lifting weights for only a couple of years now, but I know everything about almost any supplement out there. I am only 16 years old and have only started taking supplements about 6 months ago. I have not yet taken androstene, but I have taken tribulus and DHEA. What is being described here is a case of so called "roid rage".
True, increased testosterone is a result of this supplement, but it will not increase aggression by any amount unless the user is in some way or another abusing the product. Young adolescent males often have the tendency to "push it," or in this case, abuse supplements. When taken in accordance to the directions and recommendations, andro will work for just about everybody. However, an explanation of these cases of aggression may be a simple matter. If the user does not work out enough or not at all, but still consumes this supplement...the increased testosterone can have effects on the person's behavior. Also, if the user is young, say 18 years old, the amount of testosterone they produce is already an incredible amount! It will still, however, help the person in the weight room.
In short, my opinion is that these cases of aggression are simply the result of being young, hormone driven young adults. Also, these users need to learn how to control themselves. Blaming the supplement is not an excuse by any means. USE IT WISELY.
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